ALEX SLOAN: The Treasurer Wayne Swan is making news today, again it's about surplus. He's written an essay for The Monthly magazine saying that our fair go culture is under threat by a small group of the very rich, including Andrew Forrest, Gina Rinehart and Clive Palmer.
Wayne Swan writes that they are using their riches to undermine good public policy, and ''threaten our democracy''. What do you think? 1300 681 666, the text number, 0467 922 666.
Richard Wood joins me this morning. Richard, hello.
RICHARD WOOD: Hello.
ALEX SLOAN: Now I've only read the extracts and report in the FinReview, I don't know if you've read the whole essay, have you?
RICHARD WOOD: No, I haven't had a chance yet, one's waiting in my mail box.
ALEX SLOAN: Oh, okay. What are you making of this lash by Wayne Swan?
RICHARD WOOD: Well from what I've read in The Australian Financial Review, he's an absolute hypocrite, to be quite frank. One of the most dangerous things that can happen is when big Government and big business get into bed together to negotiate outcomes, and that's precisely what he did, and Julia Gillard did, over the mining tax, with big mining companies, on renewable energy, and the carbon tax, the renewable energy industries, and those are far bigger threats to democracy than miners advocating what they want...
ALEX SLOAN: So you're saying they did that to win the election?
RICHARD WOOD: They did, and that's a very serious threat to democracy, because when it's done behind closed doors, and when it's big business and big Government, what every consumer and taxpayer should do is reach for their wallet, because that's what is going to be raided.
ALEX SLOAN: The biggest amount that was handed back to the mining companies was about $50 billion, is that right?
RICHARD WOOD: I don't know the exact figures, but it's a very significant amount of money, and the system that was designed favoured big business against new enterprises and smaller mining companies, and that's what ultimately happens when you have different negotiations.
ALEX SLOAN: Do you think this is pay-back time, from Wayne Swan?
RICHARD WOOD: Well, I think it is, and I think he's trying to create a narrative that attacks Australia's most successful business people, and unjustifiably, you know, we need to make sure we have a fair go in this country, and that's why having an open, economic system, where the interests of a select few, are legislated for anyone new who wants to enter the business environment, and that's what this Government has done.
ALEX SLOAN: Do you think this signals a campaign against what Wayne Swan describes as the increasing power of vested interests?
RICHARD WOOD: I think it's a declaration in that direction, but you know, what Wayne Swan and Julia Gillard and the rest of the Government have consistently done, is try to attack their opposition and those people who stand up against them, and against the policies they want to advance. Good public policy to Wayne Swan, is what he agrees with, not what other people agree with, and it's just part of a political stunt, which I'm sure will ultimately backfire.
ALEX SLOAN: Again, I haven't read the whole essay, I'm just going from the extracts in The Australian Financial Review today, it says — and Wayne Swan says, 'Policies in place of choice between, and I quote, exploiting divisions by promoting fear, or appealing to the sense of fairness and decency that is the foundation of our middle class society'...
RICHARD WOOD: Well that's an — I don't broadly disagree with that, but what he interprets that in terms of turning it into public policy, we probably disagree with, because what Wayne Swan's tried to do in the past in justifying this concept of a fair go, is have private meetings with big business to negotiate deals which suit the Government and big business, and if there's any threat to our fair go culture, it's creating these sorts of taxes and regulations which make it harder for you, me or anybody else, to get into, to create new businesses, and create our own wealth opportunities.
ALEX SLOAN: Just to quote him, he says, 'The infamous millionaires' protest, Ax the Tax, against the mining tax, would have been laughed out of town in the Australia I grew up in, and yet it received a wide and favourable reception two years ago'.
RICHARD WOOD: Well it certainly did, because I think what Wayne Swan also didn't understand, and the Government ultimately didn't understand, is that mining royalties are the domain of the state, and what we have is states that have very significant mining deposits, mineral deposits in places like Queensland and in Western Australia, and we're a federation, they're owned by those states, and what those states know is that when the money goes to Canberra, it gets allocated based on political objectives, in places like Victoria and New South Wales and Queensland, and they were being sold short.
ALEX SLOAN: Yes. Another quote, 'A handful of...' this is from Wayne Swan, 'A handful of vested interests that have pocketed a disproportionate share of the nation's economic success now feel they have a right to shape Australia's future, to satisfy their own self-interest'.
RICHARD WOOD: Oh look, I don't dispute that there clearly is a push from people who have become very successful, to advance what they consider to be their view, but what's the alternative? To shut down free speech? See, I think it's better that we have them advocating it in the public domain, because there's a higher degree of transparency, and you and I can read what miners are getting, big miners are getting, up to other big businesses. What's really dangerous to a fair go, what's really dangerous to our democracy, is when it's done behind closed doors, like Wayne Swan did over the mining tax.
ALEX SLOAN: Clive Palmer has already responded, saying Wayne Swan has a responsibility to everyone, without fear or favour, and he feels that Wayne Swan is favouring his responsibility for workers, at the exclusion of all other Australians.
RICHARD WOOD: I actually think that's too generous towards Wayne Swan on this occasion, because workers are the same people who are going to be hit by things like the carbon tax, workers are the same ones who are going to be locked out of the potential to set up new businesses every time regulations make it harder, and that's what we're seeing. The best thing we can have is an open and transparent political system.
ALEX SLOAN: Richard Wood, will any good come out of this? Will there be a national conversation?
RICHARD WOOD: It'll be interesting to see, I've no doubt there'll be lots of people who will back Wayne Swan up, but I hope in doing so they have that discussion with the people, the public, about the consequences of when Government gets together with big business, and has negotiations behind closed doors, because that's the real threat to a fair go.
ALEX SLOAN: Richard Wood, nice to talk to you. Thanks for joining me.
RICHARD WOOD: Thanks for having me.
ALEX SLOAN: Happy to hear your thoughts this morning, and as I said, I haven't read the whole essay, I've read the extracts today in The Australian Financial Review, and Wayne Swan is saying that our fair go culture is under threat by a small group of the very rich, including Andrew Forrest, Gina Rinehart and Clive Palmer.
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